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essexandy

essexandy

The Lake Governor
Christ I never thought I'd be posting on here but here we go.

I'm seriously thinking of getting a machine and would appreciate some more opinions although I've already spoken to Monkey.
In the past most of my work has been with S&C both internally and externally and plan on continuing this but using a machine.
So firstly how do any of you guys get on using CPI for both internals and externals.
Secondly are there any other decent bagged S&C options available.
And lastly I'll be using the machine with my son so thinking one spraying the other ruling and jointly keeping the hopper loaded, does this sound viable and what machine would you experienced machine hands recommend for this (no need for you to reply Oasis)
Thanks in advance.
 
cpi can be a bit hit and miss but is generally alright. sprays well. better for inside than out i think. have had if crack a couple of times outside but not sure if that is down to the gear or not. floats nice. the bags of cpi are 25kg but small so the machines eat through them. you would possibly benefit from a lab aswell. you would need to be fast at loading and need a hopper extension to stand a chance just the 2 of you. as i have a 240 ritmo and work with 1 other spread and a lab as and when, i would say a ritmo is good for what i do. i wouldnt want a 3 phase unless i was doing mono day in day out. other alternatives are k mix and ocr as far as i no. and theyre more expensive. and cpi is expensive enough as it is compared to site mix
 
Hardwall, cpi or Mp75 are all good for internal plastering. Weber OCR is good for external stucco because it is specified as a 1 coat render. Cpi is good for backing coats and scratch coats due to its cheap cost. You have dash recievers, monocouces and textured finishes to use that all can be applied by a machine.
An apprentice is perfect if you intend being on site everyday. The plastering systems are all pretty repetitive and a decent youngster can soon pick things up. Teach him how to spray first and pretty soon he will be proficient at it. It is better to have him spraying than using a plasterer to spray because the plasterer is far more valuable to the team and whatever he does whilst the spraying is happening will be earning the team more money like ruling. Dont tie up the better skilled people on the jobs that require little experience. Instead keep an eye on the one doing it and help him correct anything he does wrong.
 
I have used Weber ocr through my PFT monojet and it is nice stuff to use. Maybe the Ritmo 240v if you are doing inside as the 3 phrase needs a decent sized genny and some expensive 3 phrase cables.
 
theblones said:
Hardwall, cpi or Mp75 are all good for internal plastering. Weber OCR is good for external stucco because it is specified as a 1 coat render. Cpi is good for backing coats and scratch coats due to its cheap cost. You have dash recievers, monocouces and textured finishes to use that all can be applied by a machine.
An apprentice is perfect if you intend being on site everyday. The plastering systems are all pretty repetitive and a decent youngster can soon pick things up. Teach him how to spray first and pretty soon he will be proficient at it. It is better to have him spraying than using a plasterer to spray because the plasterer is far more valuable to the team and whatever he does whilst the spraying is happening will be earning the team more money like ruling. Dont tie up the better skilled people on the jobs that require little experience. Instead keep an eye on the one doing it and help him correct anything he does wrong.
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good advice that.
 
You ought to get out with stu and Paul andy and have a look at the g4 and ritmo yourself
 
spunky said:
You ought to get out with stu and Paul andy and have a look at the g4 and ritmo yourself
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I was down at BG on Tuesday where Stu was helping demonstrate the Ritmos and saw both Stu and Paul using their G4/5 when they did a mono job some while ago and when they were working at Harlow. I just wanted to have some different opinions and whether I'd missed any other bagged S&C apart from CPI and OCR. I didn't go to Erith thinking of buying a machine but watching Stu spray that gear on so effortlessly (I know he makes it look easy) really got me thinking. The only downside I can see is the cost of the CPI compared with site mixed S&C and whether we would cover more area to make up for the extra cost of supplying.
 
Spunk,

Based on 40 to 43 m2 at 16mm per 1250 kg ........a rough guide is £ 2.20 m2 for traditional s/c as opposed to £ 4.65 m2 for CPI
 
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spunky said:
How much is it per m difference to supply andy?
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I've been quoted £3.50 a bag for CPI which I'm told should do just over the metre so about £2.70 m2. Whereas I get sand for £246 for a ten ton load and OPC for £2.75 a bag, so with additives I allow £1.40 m2 for site mixed S&C. Quite a difference isn't it Spunks but if the machine means higher productivity then it may work out better financially as well as being lighter on my poor old body.
 
CurrierPlastering said:
How much extra meterage you gonna need to do to break even?
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By my reckoning we'd need to cover an extra 20 m2 a day but as you'd be taking a lot of the grunt out of the job this may well be doable. Working with a labourer I average 75 m2 hand applying S&C on standard housing. How much is achievable using a machine is one of the answers I was hoping someone would pop up with.
 
you would easy do another 30m2 at least ive done with a 2+1 150m2 of hardwall and set in a day but they were big walls in a school
 
and cpi is fine for internals bit slow on a scratch coat though just do two passes one after the other
 
essexandy said:
I've been quoted £3.50 a bag for CPI which I'm told should do just over the metre so about £2.70 m2. Whereas I get sand for £246 for a ten ton load and OPC for £2.75 a bag, so with additives I allow £1.40 m2 for site mixed S&C. Quite a difference isn't it Spunks but if the machine means higher productivity then it may work out better financially as well as being lighter on my poor old body.
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Hi Andy,

quick question, what thickness are you basing these calcs on.

Also , we are fairly green to machine work, we are 9 months into runnung one, mainly monos and s/c . EWI we still do by hand.If you take out the first month as the steepest part of your learning curve, you should hope to double the amounts you would normally do by hand,( subject to complexity of job and other variables. )

We are pretty effiecent now and would def say, I do not regret the purchase at all. ( and the old tennis elbow has calmed, so thats a huge plus in this game)
 
southernmonkey said:
andy if you want some bags of cpi to try i'v got about half a dozen or so your more then welcome to have them
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How about I pay for the CPI and you give me the Ritmo Stu?

mark ross said:
Hi Andy,

quick question, what thickness are you basing these calcs on.

Also , we are fairly green to machine work, we are 9 months into runnung one, mainly monos and s/c . EWI we still do by hand.If you take out the first month as the steepest part of your learning curve, you should hope to double the amounts you would normally do by hand,( subject to complexity of job and other variables. )

We are pretty effiecent now and would def say, I do not regret the purchase at all. ( and the old tennis elbow has calmed, so thats a huge plus in this game)
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I'd worked that out using a 11-13mm coat on internal work, is that about right for CPI?
 
andy, 3 of us sprayed 180m2 of internal cpi in a day, all ready for skim a few years back, i know cpi sounds more expensive but when you look at the labour cost involved with mixing, wheeling in and then hodding upstairs its a no brainer to me. If your doing internal cpi then you just spray all day. you have the machine in one place. we also done a 4mil house in mp75 the other month and the machine staying in the hall from when we started to finish. If you get a cpi job and want me to come along and pump for you so you can get a feel to what its like let me or stu know.
 
Cheers Paul, Stu has already offered to come over to us for the day and we will be taking him up on the offer once we get the machine. I might bring my son out to see one of you spraying if you're reasonably close in the next week or so, on the other hand I don't want to put him of.
 
essexandy said:
By my reckoning we'd need to cover an extra 20 m2 a day but as you'd be taking a lot of the grunt out of the job this may well be doable. Working with a labourer I average 75 m2 hand applying S&C on standard housing. How much is achievable using a machine is one of the answers I was hoping someone would pop up with.
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What sort of sites do you work on?

I wish housing sites down here where all sand and cement, not seen s&c on site for years, only when scratching party walls before dabbing...
 
essexandy said:
Cheers Paul, Stu has already offered to come over to us for the day and we will be taking him up on the offer once we get the machine. I might bring my son out to see one of you spraying if you're reasonably close in the next week or so, on the other hand I don't want to put him of.
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He is looking at ways to get days off while me and ian keep the business going.
 
you sounded rushed off your feet on friday pretending to be doing the accounts ....while me and ian were sweating our nuts off keeping the business running
 
not rushed of my feet just ******* stressed trying to sort the mess you leave me with every month. and i really enjoyed the coffee and sandwich that the bank supplied me before our meeting and all the coffee and biscuits while having our meeting, that was very stressful
 
s.p.t plastering said:
What sort of sites do you work on?

I wish housing sites down here where all sand and cement, not seen s&c on site for years, only when scratching party walls before dabbing...
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Over the last twenty years I've done sites of 5, 14, 52, 132 and 540 plus loads of singles and other small sites I've forgotten the exact size of and just before I packed it all in about 20 months ago I won three sites of 4, 12 and 18 houses that had been down to be drylined until I priced them offering the S&C option.
 
essexandy said:
Over the last twenty years I've done sites of 5, 14, 52, 132 and 540 plus loads of singles and other small sites I've forgotten the exact size of and just before I packed it all in about 20 months ago I won three sites of 4, 12 and 18 houses that had been down to be drylined until I priced them offering the S&C option.
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I'd love it if they brought s&c floating back on site, only done a year or so on end of my apprentership and much prefered it, never get to use any for floatig these days...

Can float for a few days, then drop back and plaster...Love it!..
 
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