How to plaster over internal sand / cement render

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eon

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I have used an sand and cement render internally on 4 walls in my house following the removal of an internal chimney breast (with the intention of adding a little strength following the brick removal, etc).

On the upper floor there were 2 internal walls - each was brick, and was rendered with 12-15mm of sand / cement render at a mix of 1 part cement to 4 parts sand (and the sand was 3 parts plastering sand to one part building sand). On this floor no waterproofer was used in the render.

On the lower floor there was 1 internal and 1 external wall, both brick, which were rendered with 12-15mm of sand / cement render at a mix of 1 part cement to 4 parts sand (and the sand was 3 parts plastering sand to one part building sand) - on this floor wickes standard waterproofer was used.

I thought everything looked good - but the final surface of the render was finished with a wooden float and then scored in a wavy line using 3 screws protruding about 2-3mm about an inch apart on a wooden batton. Each set of these wavy scratches have a gap of around 3 inches before the next set, and I have been warned that this might not be ideal spacing to provide the best possible key to plaster on?

The rendering was done on a DIY basis using batons, but I was hoping to get a plasterer to apply a plaster finish.

Can anyone give me some advice about what options there are to get a plaster finish on this type of surface?

One plasterer has suggested he would apply a tight coat of bonding before plastering, but I have another friend who seems very against the idea of using any bonding (if possible) who says he thinks we should find a way of doing this without using bonding because of possible issues later on with damp, etc?

It would be great to get some advice on what could be done in this situation? Is bonding the way to go? Are there other options? Am I doomed? :RpS_unsure:
 
A photo of the actual walls will help get some more meaningful advise if you could post some
 
Give it a scrape down ,PVA it ,lay on FIRST COAT of skim ,rule it off ,let it take for a few minutes ,and then ...wait for it ,apply your SECOND COAT of skim,let it tighten slightly and flatten ,Finish with a polish ,Taah Daah


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You should have done everything the other way around. You should have got a plasterer in to float the place out, which is arguably harder, and then tried your hand at skimming. That's probably why the plasterer suggested a tight coat of bonding, because the walls are all over the show. It would be like skimming a football. Maybe that's why SPREADS has suggested ruling off the skim coat...?
 
Spot on Jurek ,although my opinion isn't always welcome ,it would be something I would do over any background,especially over sand and cement ,that's just the way I was thought,and to me ,maybe me alone ,that's the right way.


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The sand and cement may shrink and crack leaving hairline cracks,when i first bought my house i rendered inside on some downstairs walls due purely down to costs i had gutted house,new roof,fliirs,ceilings,double stone extension,after a good while wall had hairline cracks nothing loose or that paper wouldnt hide but wanted to stick with paint,so bonding paint and reskimmed a great years later,no problems
 
Thanks for all the info and tips - it is very useful and much appreciated.

Apologies but I don't have any pictures at present and will take any advice "as is" because of this!

Earlier, when I mentioned that the plasterer wanted to apply a tight coat of bonding - I think the plasterer was referring to a layer of carlite bonding plaster (and not a coat of a primer that would improve bonding).

After reading all the feedback I have a quick question:

Is it a probably a good idea to try not to use the carlite bonding plaster if possible? (I know it is hard to tell without seeing it, but I just mean "in principle")

I think he had concerns about adhesion to my rendered surface and also potential cracking (I think he mentioned there may be cracking if he had to use a thicker coat of whatever plaster he was applying, to make up for any problems with the flatness of my rendered surface). I thought that the rendering was fairly flat - but as I mentioned earlier, I am not a plasterer, so have no idea what is acceptable!

The other person that has been giving me advice still seems to think that it would be a shame to use an under coat of bonding plaster as it may lead to issues later on with damp, etc.

I was wondering if you guys had any feedback regarding whether the extra layer of carlite bonding is worth avoiding if possible? Is it a risk if used over render that had a waterproofer in it?
 
I would just the the plasterer you have do his job!
After all he is the only one that has seen it.
 
Thanks for all the info and tips - it is very useful and much appreciated.

Apologies but I don't have any pictures at present and will take any advice "as is" because of this!

Earlier, when I mentioned that the plasterer wanted to apply a tight coat of bonding - I think the plasterer was referring to a layer of carlite bonding plaster (and not a coat of a primer that would improve bonding).

After reading all the feedback I have a quick question:

Is it a probably a good idea to try not to use the carlite bonding plaster if possible? (I know it is hard to tell without seeing it, but I just mean "in principle")

I think he had concerns about adhesion to my rendered surface and also potential cracking (I think he mentioned there may be cracking if he had to use a thicker coat of whatever plaster he was applying, to make up for any problems with the flatness of my rendered surface). I thought that the rendering was fairly flat - but as I mentioned earlier, I am not a plasterer, so have no idea what is acceptable!

The other person that has been giving me advice still seems to think that it would be a shame to use an under coat of bonding plaster as it may lead to issues later on with damp, etc.

I was wondering if you guys had any feedback regarding whether the extra layer of carlite bonding is worth avoiding if possible? Is it a risk if used over render that had a waterproofer in it?
 
It all depends on the thickness of the sand and cement and how flat and plumb your rendering is ! If you have put the correct ratio of water proofer in your render mix and there are no other underlying reasons for dampness issues then there is no difference in putting a thin coat of bonding on before skimming versus just cracking on and skimming it, either way if dampness was to return it would come back through which ever way you proceeded. If you are not sure about the first plasterers advice just get another plasterer to come and look at the job. Again without actually seeing the walls no one here could give you valid advice. None meant but, frankly it's a bit like asking us what colour socks your wearing today.
 
Skim a couple of walls today , over 100 years old beach sanded walls, alot ofthe old walls are done in sand from the local beach , they suck like anything, 5 lots of pva at4/1 soon stops that but you still have to flatten fast, I wasnt too push on the finish becozthis lad just wants to wallpaper them all the time, he was happy with them and decided to paint em , nice old house , he told me he had to break in to it to get the last renters out, two bedroom house rent to two lads , trouble was there was at least 6 extra people living there , nearly a skip of volka bottles whiskey and hundreds of cans of piss where they couldnt be bother to use the jacks.
 
The sand and cement with no waterproofer is going to cause some problems. It will suck in so quick that it will crack before you can trowel it up.
PVA is no good, it won't seal it enough.
Use SBR watered down. give it two coats the day before. You must let the SBR dry over night otherwise it wont be as effective.
Next day give a quick PVA and plaster it. If you leave the first coat to stiffen a lot longer than usual before you put the second coat on. this way the key lines won't show through. Failing that you could prick them up right before putting the first coat on. Or if they are really deep give it 3 coats of multi!!! :RpS_biggrin:
As said before - no photos makes it difficult to know.
Best of luck!!
 
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