Retentions...

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Annie123

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Dont know if anyone can help me on this...

We are on site, and invoicing on finished houses only, which should be deemed as 'practical completion' surly so how can the main contractor deduct 5% in retention, surely it should be 2.5%?

I have asked for their t's & c's which they sent me twice but I never received, funnily enough...

Anyone else getting this bullS***

Thanks.
 
Usually sort the payments first before you even price the job a retention is the norm as a suby you rarely get it back
 
We did, but I cant get it in writing!!!, I can understand the concept of the retention, but basically its been abused.

Read over the JCT procedure and rang a legal advisor...conclusion.

If a contract hasn't been set up on the outset, when you come off site we can hit them for the lot as we were not contractual tied...

Still awaiting retention from one of the big 6 energy companies, to be fair that's not there fault, they have just got a **** QS on board...!! I may hit them with a stat demand...lol:rolleyes)
 
If it was not agreed they can't take it,one year is what they say, luckily I never take on the bigger site work.
 
Add 5% to your price ! Retentions are another way of making money out of you ....... walk round the finished job with the contracts manager if he is happy ask for your money in full . If they keep taking retention ask them to limit it !!! Or you could tell them to get someone else ......
 
Retentions are another way of treating a subbi like s.....t some of those qs guys are spineless and they play with your money and life . It means nothing to them ...... rant over :mad:
 
if you have only been hit with 5% retention then you have been fortuitous it is usually10%. some contractors stop 2.5% citb payment and 2% main contractors discount for monthly payments as well as retention. that is why you always need to put extra on you quote.
 
Am not been funny, but if you have been commended for your work and complete on time, no snagging issues etc, I want our money back end of.....
 
And another thing, half these company's are dissolved in a year so the fat controller just ran off with half your f***** shirt...grrrrrr
 
They take 5 % retention which should be refunded after the 12 month defect period . It's normally up to you to apply for it . We have the same problem with every main contractor, the secret is to keep bugging the QS with emails and telephone calls after a while they get fed up and release it . It works for me, at the end of the day it's your MONEY !!!!!!!!!
 
Mickyboy said:
They take 5 % retention which should be refunded after the 12 month defect period . It's normally up to you to apply for it . We have the same problem with every main contractor, the secret is to keep bugging the QS with emails and telephone calls after a while they get fed up and release it . It works for me, at the end of the day it's your MONEY !!!!!!!!!
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You shouldn't need to bug anyone for your money especially a qs who is detached from you . When you buy just about anything you pay for it then recieve your goods you dont hold a bit ba ck in case there is something wrong !!!!!!! imagine buying a car and saying to the sales guy ill pay you in 12 months if I don't find a blemish on it!!!!!
 
2.5% should be released after practical completion... 2.5% after a year...we are labour only... shouldn't the system be guaranteed by the system maker...? considering we are all "accredited installers"...have the cards and that to prove it, paid for all the accreditation, the cards, insurance, nvq's, bba, citb, the list goes on ...lol

I have had a really bad day...:RpS_mad:
 
Annie123 said:
2.5% should be released after practical completion... 2.5% after a year...we are labour only... shouldn't the system be guaranteed by the system maker...? considering we are all "accredited installers"...have the cards and that to prove it, paid for all the accreditation, the cards, insurance, nvq's, bba, citb, the list goes on ...lol

I have had a really bad day...:RpS_mad:
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you are labour only ,who is suppling the material ? if you are subbing this work , i think that the contractor is ripping you off, and charging you half the retention money.
 
EWI work can be or is labour only, some heavy contractors are supply and install, but really they are just giving the funder extra credit until it picks up.. it will all change as it did with CESP, you had to have a load of accreditation, but once the game was a foot, everyone was on site..lol
 
No one has ever tried to stop 10% retention from me, 5% is fairly common. Some firms pay 2.5% after six months and then the rest after twelve.
I wouldn't stand having retention held if labour only though.
What I do is accept their retention terms for the first few jobs and then just say 'if you're not happy with our work get someone else, but if you want us to do more drop the retention'. Has always worked up to now.
 
big arguments about retention just now because in the recession its one of the things companies have stopped paying out after the twelve months is up - they are trying to find ways to wriggle out and they will.

5% is common some cases 10% but never agree to that it could be more than your profit as a contractor.

I have read alot into retention and for wet trades, professionals say it should be no more than 2.5 % as the work is nearly always cosmetics/weather protection.
5% would be acceptable for the steel engineers etc where there could be substantial and costly rectifications but not for wet trades.

sad thing is i aint seen 2.5 retention for a long long time. perhaps 7 years ago or more even.

the MC holds all the cards all the time and if you dont play to their rules/terms then usually you dont get the work.

simple and wrong at the same time.
 
Annie123 said:
2.5% should be released after practical completion... 2.5% after a year...we are labour only... shouldn't the system be guaranteed by the system maker...? considering we are all "accredited installers"...have the cards and that to prove it, paid for all the accreditation, the cards, insurance, nvq's, bba, citb, the list goes on ...lol

I have had a really bad day...:RpS_mad:
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the warranty for this type of work is usually back to back with the installer not just a warranty from tthe manufacturer who only warrant the actual material
you will normally have to have an insurance backed guarantee also that cover your warranty and maintains it in case you go bust - also common for firms dealing in this field.
 
you all need to get onto the nscc and their fair payment campaign. the voice will only be heard if it is loud. join and make it louder
 
Who ultimately pays for that 5%??? US, ME, YOU, YOURS....

I just had to delete about 5 yards of writing just then....
 
I find you have to re invoice for the retention. Yes I agree it should be released but it rarely is. If you don't invoice it you ain't getting it...MC's extra profit if you don't so. I have a retention diary, when I invoice the client it put in the details in the diary on the date it's due and invoice them accordingly. Fairly successful to date :)


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Annie123 said:
Who ultimately pays for that 5%??? US, ME, YOU, YOURS....

I just had to delete about 5 yards of writing just then....
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in many cases you lose it - welcome to the the industry - welcome to great britain.

invoicing it is a must, oh yeah no one will give you YOUR money unless you beg for it.
 
owls said:
are you a member of inca john lad?
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No pal

Got a sponsor lined up and was thinking of doing my junior member/interim membership doo daa in preperation for full membership but then i dont think it will benefit me tbh and there are other players out there now that can be just as good for you but I am really trying to grow the private side of the business as the sites are dead, no money in it and as for EWI on the commercial side not worth doin

much much easier ways to make money if you can run a business etc.
 
I took my own advice today........ I added 5% to my price having been tood thats what they are going to take ! Still got the job ....... I must be cheap !!!!!!!
 
My mate just had big site and got done over. The contractors saying that other lads had to go over their work .load of **** he bis spread an takes pride in his work . They r just spineless ***** trying to save an don't give a **** bout lads that carry out the actual jobs for them . No decent firms that honour nothing now. That's why I try stay away


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They need to give him the opportunity to rectify his work before they could do that. If they haven't get him to get a solicitor to sort it. Say they want to do core samples to see this new layer of plaster.

Or just punch the blokes head in
 
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I know mate . I know the standard my mate puts out and it's good. Apparently the firm do that to everyone an sometimes not pay them at all . They get lads in for month tell them work shite an not pay them them gets over lads to finish an tell them the same.


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Gorto said:
I know mate . I know the standard my mate puts out and it's good. Apparently the firm do that to everyone an sometimes not pay them at all . They get lads in for month tell them work shite an not pay them them gets over lads to finish an tell them the same.


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Always wary of finishing work that's been started especially if its a good standard that's been left. If its dog rough fair enough you can see why they were chased but, if its a decent finish the alarm bells start ringing.
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faithful said:
You shouldn't need to bug anyone for your money especially a qs who is detached from you . When you buy just about anything you pay for it then recieve your goods you dont hold a bit ba ck in case there is something wrong !!!!!!! imagine buying a car and saying to the sales guy ill pay you in 12 months if I don't find a blemish on it!!!!!
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I agree with what you say , but don't forget the QS May be detached from you but he as a obligation towards the main contractor who is pulling the strings. Unfortunately this is what happens in our industry. The only solution is to stay way from the big boys who stop the retentions from your pay packet
 
Gorto said:
I know mate . I know the standard my mate puts out and it's good. Apparently the firm do that to everyone an sometimes not pay them at all . They get lads in for month tell them work shite an not pay them them gets over lads to finish an tell them the same.


I'm using The Plasterers Forum Mobile App
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there is a british standard for plastering BS EN 13914_2:2005. now if you are a plastering contractor on a construction site you do need to know the standard and be able to quote that against any problem that the building contractor may think that he has got. it is your job to convince the builder that he has received a quality piece of work, and collect the payment, not walk away with no money.
 
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