Cracks in Newly Skimmed Over-Boarded Ceiling

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JonC said:
Thanks for all the replies and advice. Think I'll investigate a crack and make sure there's scrim tape there. Was concerned the plaster looked so thin but sounds like if it was scrimmed then it's purely down to movement. I'm afraid the motorbike and mould references were over my head but generally all replies have been very helpful. Cheers. Jon.
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They are forum jokes :( sad I know
 
JonC said:
Hi all,
I'm hoping for a bit of advice.. I've just had my front room ceiling skimmed and cracks have appeared along the joints after less than a week. I batoned and boarded the ceiling myself, cross batoning across the joist to level out with the 1" x 2" batons spaced at 400mm centres, and screwed in to the joists at every intersection with 3" to 4" 12 screws depending on the depth of packing. This was rock solid - I could easily hang off the batons between the joists. The boards are 12mm and fixed with drywall screws every 150mm along the batons with a 3mm gap left around all edges. The batoning and boarding was done at the end of November and the plastering was done last week so it's had plenty of time to settle and dry out.
Initially it looked as if the plasterers had done a good job, but when I went to start fixing up the cornice this weekend I noticed several cracks appearing at the joints. I also noticed that the plaster is extremely thin (not more than 1mm) at the cut-out for the ceiling light. I called the plasterer who came to have a look but said that it looks as if it's dried out too quickly and that they always feather down to the ceiling light. I pointed out that there is no radiator in the room so it can't be too hot, and that the plaster is completely flat over the ceiling light cut out when a 4ft level is held across it. I know the boarding was completely flat so there can't be much variance in thickness. The plasterer is getting back to me next week. He insisted they used skrim tape and applied 2 coats of plaster.
I've since noticed that the plaster is so thin that you can see the 'ghost' marks of the joints and screw heads. I've attached some photos of the cracks and the plaster depth at the ceiling light cut out. I've also attached a photo of the 'ghost' marks of the joints and screw heads. Does this look like they've applied 2 coats of plaster? Would you see the 'ghost' marks of the skrim tape if the plaster is this thin?
Anyway thanks for reading this thread. Any help or advice would be very much appreciated.
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You should only ever use paper tape.
 
Orangemachineman said:
Don't be a c u n t


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watch
 
JonC said:
Ha. If only that were true..
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Couldn't resist just scrim the cracks easi fill rub down plastering isn't an exact science and hairline cracks are part and parcel of the game I'm afraid we all get them from time to time if all that fails have you thought about artex nice comb pattern it's making a come back be one of first to have it done :bananahappy:
 
A lot of new builds get cracks from lying empty for a while.
When the home owner moves in and bangs the heating on this is when the property shrinks and expands slightly.

As for cross battening your ceilings .....its the best idea there is for over boarding.
 
BGs white book states Where there is an increased risk of cracking,
or where gaps exceed 3mm, the gaps are
reinforced with Gyproc Joint Tape bedded
in Thistle plaster. In other situations
plasterboard joints can be reinforced with
Thistle ProTape FT50 or FT100 glass fibre
mesh tape.
But who if any of us do it ?
 
I stand by there being 3mm+ gaps around each boards perimeter being probably the biggest problem along with movement from the foot traffic from being a downstairs ceiling/upstairs floor with play in joists mist likely taking the board work with it...

Also just to clarify boards should be screwed across the battons/joist not along them as that will definetley not help.
 
zombie said:
I stand by there being 3mm+ gaps around each boards perimeter being probably the biggest problem along with movement from the foot traffic from being a downstairs ceiling/upstairs floor with play in joists mist likely taking the board work with it...

Also just to clarify boards should be screwed across the battons/joist not along them as that will definetley not help.
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Liked
 
Only left a gap between boards when we used to butter up the joint for jute or cotton scrim using fiber tape not much skimming will get between the joints so no point leaving a cap, imo.
 
I over boarded my own bedroom ceilings with gaps bigger than 3mm ....was an absolute fuckkng ball ache to do putting in battons all over.....who ever put the room on the top floor made a mess of the bedroom ceilings.
I lost patience....fired the boards on and filled with drywall adhesive triple scrimmed it 1 coat skim.
They are now fantastic !!!
 
I'm sure I seen some gear made in Poland where they don't have to use any tape or scrim on the joints, can't find it now for the life of me
 
Problem with paper tape is if if it's not bedded right it bubbles and peels off.
Plus the op looks like he used square edge boards which technically is the wrong board for paper tape.

I do however agree done properly paper tape is better than scrim.

I actually use paper tape for big cracks or when someone's having an extension and 2 different substrates meet. As it does work.
 
zolco said:
I'm sure I seen some gear made in Poland where they don't have to use any tape or scrim on the joints, can't find it now for the life of me
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I was on a Job last year, full house fella was English with Italian parents. His wife was Polish.
Her old fella was a builder back home and came over to help out.
The only English word he could speak was "coffee"
It was a nightmare.
He'd never been over here before and when doing the house they decided I was doing everything plastering related except the kitchen which they were going to do.
Record it etc.
Anyway I walked in 1 morning and there he was plodding on .
The silly t**t was trying to tape and joint using multi.
There was enough on to skim the room and he's was trying to sand it back with a sanding block.
I cracked up laughing trying to explain.
Obviously he had no clue and couldn't understand me
Had to ring his daughter to translate.
I felt that sorry for him I went merchants and bought him some bags of easy fill and a proper sanding pad to do it.
You would have thought I'd given him a million pound
 
Agree with formby, battens probably the cause, too flexi. I'd use render scrim on joints and reskim.
 
a pallet of P5 chipboard in the loftroom falling over ripped through my lounge ceiling... gutted I was... but filled and painted and its fine :D
 
algeeman said:
Absolute shite ...how does making a ceiling stronger cause it to flex ??
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You dont need to strip a ceiling to cross batten it.
But if you decide to strip it first and hammer the shhit out of it your gonna get loose joints the same as knocking off render ....too ruthless will fuuck the brick/block work.
 
algeeman said:
You dont need to strip a ceiling to cross batten it.
But if you decide to strip it first and hammer the shhit out of it your gonna get loose joints the same as knocking off render ....too ruthless will fuuck the brick/block work.
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The same as eating 12 cadbury mini rolls on top of 12 cans of stella will make you .....quezy ??
 
@algeeman , it was , and still is normal to ask questions and expect answers, but the moment you start to answer your own questions is time to revisite your brain condition!
 
zombie said:
I stand by there being 3mm+ gaps around each boards perimeter being probably the biggest problem along with movement from the foot traffic from being a downstairs ceiling/upstairs floor with play in joists mist likely taking the board work with it...

Also just to clarify boards should be screwed across the battons/joist not along them as that will definetley not help.
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Thanks. Meant to say noggins on long sides. The battens are at 90deg to the window wall and the boards run parallel.
 
algeeman said:
Absolute shite ...how does making a ceiling stronger cause it to flex ??
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Thanks for the input on this. Do you think it's been caused by drying out too quick then or do you think it's a problem with the plastering? Cheers. Jon.
 
JonC said:
Thanks. Meant to say noggins on long sides. The battens are at 90deg to the window wall and the boards run parallel.
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I was meaning that boards shouldn't be placed parallel to what there being screwed onto on ceilings...ie the timber should run across the lengths I'd the boards not along them...

I genuinky believe the biggest problem though mate is the 3mm gaps around each board I always but mine up tight as possible...

Good luck
 
zombie said:
I was meaning that boards shouldn't be placed parallel to what there being screwed onto on ceilings...ie the timber should run across the lengths I'd the boards not along them...

I genuinky believe the biggest problem though mate is the 3mm gaps around each board I always but mine up tight as possible...

Good luck
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Thanks. Yes that's what I was meaning. Boards are at right angles to the battens. Cheers.
 
zombie said:
I was meaning that boards shouldn't be placed parallel to what there being screwed onto on ceilings...ie the timber should run across the lengths I'd the boards not along them...

I genuinky believe the biggest problem though mate is the 3mm gaps around each board I always but mine up tight as possible...

Good luck
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On the pictures it doesn't look like there's a 3mm gap around each board.

@JonC are the 3mm gaps your talking about around each actual board?

If so I'm with @zombie that's the problem
 
reeves1985 said:
On the pictures it doesn't look like there's a 3mm gap around each board.

@JonC are the 3mm gaps your talking about around each actual board?

If so I'm with @zombie that's the problem
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Hi. Yes 3mm gaps round each board and round the ceiling edges. Always thought this was good practice? Plasterer never said otherwise. Thanks.
 
JonC said:
Hi. Yes 3mm gaps round each board and round the ceiling edges. Always thought this was good practice? Plasterer never said otherwise. Thanks.
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I always butt mine up as tight as I can get them.
Any slight flex is going to cause all the gear squeezed in the joint to come loose.
Fibre tape with then move causing a crack.

I could be wrong here and I'm sure someone will say if I am but I was always under the impression that square edge boards are supposed to be butted up.
Tapered edge boards are supposed to be for tape and joint and they are Tapered so you can get gear in the joint to bed the tape.
 
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