To mesh or not to mesh??

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Marshy

Private Member
Right lads I've got a large gable to do where the original render has blown completely (done very badly I might add) the brickwork underneath is a smooth common, (not engineering or accrington) its an old farmhouse not anything modern.
I originally priced to mesh it but after reading a lot on the forum about external grit (am guessing similar to betonkontakt)
Would this be good enough alternative without cutting corners?
I'm doing two coat sand cement plain float finish/sponged and free formed quoins down the exterior edges to look like old stone.
If the grit adhesive would work it will save my customer a few quid which I am keen to do as he's a good bloke who will put more work my way.
Your thoughts please chaps are much appreciated :RpS_thumbup:

PS @Artisan998 please no IMO advice :RpS_lol:
 
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Arti

Well-Known Member
I grit product isnt gonna do the same thing as mesh its goona give you a better key but so would an SBR slurry which you could knock up ya sell

. but an alternative to mesh would be to put fibres in the gear........................IMO..............which would be cheaper than mesh.

Av never used mesh in S&C so others who do/have can probably give you a more structured answer.....................IMO
 

Marshy

Private Member
You really should have won the "most helpful member award"!! Arti :RpS_thumbup:…



IMO :RpS_thumbsup:
 

Rigsby

TPF Special Forces
I would have more confidence in using sbr slurry as an adhesive. Sand and cement in my opinion is heavier than the manufactured renders.

Mesh? We'll yes if you have no suction giving you time to bed in and skim over otherwise it could become two coats with a layer of plastic mesh in-between not doing a lot. Plenty of fibres should work without the need of the two coats required for sheet mesh. I would consider putting some stress patches in for good measure.
 

Marshy

Private Member
I would have more confidence in using sbr slurry as an adhesive. Sand and cement in my opinion is heavier than the manufactured renders.

Mesh? We'll yes if you have no suction giving you time to bed in and skim over otherwise it could become two coats with a layer of plastic mesh in-between not doing a lot. Plenty of fibres should work without the need of the two coats required for sheet mesh. I would consider putting some stress patches in for good measure.
Thanks Rigsby, I hadn't considered doing a slurry and knew mesh would be foolproof if a little OTT? The guy who did the job originally is a family "friend" but screwed them on price and his workmanship (if we can call it that) was nothing short of diabolical !! My aim is to try and save the customer a few quid but not cut corners or its me who suffers and its likely I'll get more work off this as he's in the building trade and knows a lot of people? My main work contact passed away before Christmas and his firm closing down so any new contacts would be great right now.
 

Dansouthcoast84

Private Member
Im with rigby. Slurry the brickwork. Must admit never used alkaline mesh with sand cement. Think its too heavy for that. But each to their own.
 

Marshy

Private Member
The mesh I'm on about is EML plugged and screwed to the wall first for a better key apologies if I've explained myself badly??
 

Marshy

Private Member
The brickwork is smooth and the other guys work has completly blown and looks will fall off in a big sheet?! Its as if it hasn't ever bonded to the wall at all?? So I thought I'd cover myself by pricing for eml but the time it takes to fix and cost etc I just thought if there was a better quicker alternative to save the customer a few bob but more importantly not cutting corners or I'd not bother.
 

Olican

Private Member
The brickwork is smooth and the other guys work has completly blown and looks will fall off in a big sheet?! Its as if it hasn't ever bonded to the wall at all?? So I thought I'd cover myself by pricing for eml but the time it takes to fix and cost etc I just thought if there was a better quicker alternative to save the customer a few bob but more importantly not cutting corners or I'd not bother.
I've rendered over that smooth brick work plenty of times bud and never had a crack. Nice sbr will do the trick bud :RpS_thumbsup: definitely don't use IMO if you can help it, you mentioned OTT I wouldn't use this either. OTT IS too expensive :RpS_thumbup: Best of luck my lovely
 

Dansouthcoast84

Private Member
The brickwork is smooth and the other guys work has completly blown and looks will fall off in a big sheet?! Its as if it hasn't ever bonded to the wall at all?? So I thought I'd cover myself by pricing for eml but the time it takes to fix and cost etc I just thought if there was a better quicker alternative to save the customer a few bob but more importantly not cutting corners or I'd not bother.
Would he be capable of meshing?
In my opinion. If gable cracked then mesh. If looks good slurry
 

Marshy

Private Member
Cheers Oli lad, I had it in my head to mesh in order to cover myself but as you lads on here are a helpful bunch and up to speed on more modern adhesives like IMO etc I just thought I'd ask mi old mucker :RpS_thumbup: think I will do a slurry that will be doing the job right and save my customer a few quid so alls well that ends well, cheers lads :RpS_thumbsup:
 

Marshy

Private Member
The brickwork is in good nick Dan, the guy who rendered it seems to have just chucked it on and hoped for the best? The pr*ck even went to the floor!!?? And for as so called "friend" he's charged them top whack ?? Not a plasterer or friend for that matter if you ask me??
 

Arti

Well-Known Member
Yes of course you did Arti, soaked in IMO I suppose :RpS_laugh:

Ive taken my p1ss taking hat off and i defo thought you meant fibre mesh marra.Thats why i said fibres would be an alternative to mesh..........

Next time just say EML and ill know what ya on about.............:RpS_wink:
 

Rigsby

TPF Special Forces
Just a thought? It is coming off in sheets? Has the wall had Thompsons water repellent put on it in the past? If it has then you might have a job getting anything to stick, therefore eml may be your only chance.

The mesh I use for sand and cement is 8mm, the 4mm stuff is too small. If you was to use eml and you made a good job of getting it tight then consider that the material is only going on and not fully around the wire. If the material has not stuck to the brick then at best the wire will be a carrier and only a part one at that. So, how about something like Plastprime x or similar what will stick to the brick (If Thompsons not involved) put on and then gone over with a roller to give a spiky surface (bark or stipple) and let set. Then fix the eml and the spikes will allow in places for the material to get under the wire? Then you have a bonding agent that will stick to the brick and the render and if you want assurance the eml as well although ott imo.
 

Marshy

Private Member
Just a thought? It is coming off in sheets? Has the wall had Thompsons water repellent put on it in the past? If it has then you might have a job getting anything to stick, therefore eml may be your only chance.

The mesh I use for sand and cement is 8mm, the 4mm stuff is too small. If you was to use eml and you made a good job of getting it tight then consider that the material is only going on and not fully around the wire. If the material has not stuck to the brick then at best the wire will be a carrier and only a part one at that. So, how about something like Plastprime x or similar what will stick to the brick (If Thompsons not involved) put on and then gone over with a roller to give a spiky surface (bark or stipple) and let set. Then fix the eml and the spikes will allow in places for the material to get under the wire? Then you have a bonding agent that will stick to the brick and the render and if you want assurance the eml as well although ott imo.
The waterseal stuff hadn't crossed my mind Rigsby? In my experience when water is sprayed on to a wall treated in that stuff it just beads up on the surface and doesn't soak in??
If that is the case then your proposed method will help? I've not been since august last year so I'm going back up with the scaffolder in next day or two so will have a shifty then? Cheers Rigsby for your help :RpS_thumbup:
 

keithuk

Private Member
Rendaid is quick cheap way £16(ish) abag 5/7 m ,out of it depending how you put it on ,trowel or roller , we trowel on then use the roller to stipple it , have you used it before Marshy ?
 

superspread

Well-Known Member
The waterseal stuff hadn't crossed my mind Rigsby? In my experience when water is sprayed on to a wall treated in that stuff it just beads up on the surface and doesn't soak in??
If that is the case then your proposed method will help? I've not been since august last year so I'm going back up with the scaffolder in next day or two so will have a shifty then? Cheers Rigsby for your help :RpS_thumbup:
You need rib lath marshy not eml but that's even more expensive,but that's not your problem like I said on the other thread with asif don't put yourself in the line of fire to be shot at , I know it sounds harsh and you want to help ,like we all do,but I've learnt the hard way,if in doubt so no,that's always stood me in good sted.
 

Marshy

Private Member
Rendaid is quick cheap way £16(ish) abag 5/7 m ,out of it depending how you put it on ,trowel or roller , we trowel on then use the roller to stipple it , have you used it before Marshy ?
No mate I havnt and as you can gather some if not all of my methods are quite old school?
 

Marshy

Private Member
You need rib lath marshy not eml but that's even more expensive,but that's not your problem like I said on the other thread with asif don't put yourself in the line of fire to be shot at , I know it sounds harsh and you want to help ,like we all do,but I've learnt the hard way,if in doubt so no,that's always stood me in good sted.
Good point, I'm not going to do anything willingly risking myself getting it wrong or chance it failing? If I have doubts its EML all the way with plenty of fixings? Bit labourious etc but so beit
 

superspread

Well-Known Member
Good point, I'm not going to do anything willingly risking myself getting it wrong or chance it failing? If I have doubts its EML all the way with plenty of fixings? Bit labourious etc but so beit
Couldn't the client fix the eml,is he capable that would save him a few quid,just give him a few pointers
 

Arti

Well-Known Member
what about telling him about the riblath and slurry..........................:huh:
 

carlos

Private Member
The waterseal stuff hadn't crossed my mind Rigsby? In my experience when water is sprayed on to a wall treated in that stuff it just beads up on the surface and doesn't soak in??
If that is the case then your proposed method will help? I've not been since august last year so I'm going back up with the scaffolder in next day or two so will have a shifty then? Cheers Rigsby for your help :RpS_thumbup:

If the walls be treated with a water repellent it will bead up. Like a freshly waxed car....:RpS_wink:
 
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