Crying client.

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Jgreenplastering

Jgreenplastering

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So I visited a job at dinner.
Client had the house re rendered last year.
It's all failed.
I asked why she didn't get him back and she said she wanted him no where near the house!
Long story short the 'renderer' only hacked off the hollow bits then went straight over painted render with a traditional sand and cement mix.
It's all cracked and crazed and he didn't take off any pipes, gutters etc so looks ruff as.
I explained he bodged it and it's gonna cost about 10-12k to redo it properly.

It's 130m2 in south west of England.
That's to hack off the last scratch and top coat and the original render coats.
Redo with a Parex meshed base coat and mono top coat. (Poss some dubbing out).
Re do all plastic.
Scaffold
Waste removal
Site clean up.
Materials and labour.

When I told her the price she started to cry and said they didn't have that kind of money.

I told her what she has May last a bit longer but unless it's done properly I wouldn't touch it and I'd advise her to not spend anything unless it's done properly.
Sounds like she spent 5k on the last bloke which isn't cheap money but then it wasn't the right way in the first place so I can see how the last bloke new what he was doing.

I felt sorry for her, told her that she would be best getting a independent surveyor in to confirm what I say so it's not just another company trying to have her other.
Clients rely on us to tell them what needs doing and expect it done right. There are a lot that want a cheap job but there are also a lot that just want it done right and done once but know no better.

I'm not offering her any discount or doing the job for nothing as it wasn't my fault and I'm a business not a charity but what do others do in this situation?






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theclemo said:
Can you not get them to hack back to the block work. And then you do the job in s@c should be a lot cheaper for them.
Click to expand...

I've just invested in a machine so no chance of me using traditional sand and cement ever again!

I could ask but they don't seem the sort who know how or where to start so just want it done properly without the chance of blame being put on them I suppose.




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Getting alot of this at the moment mate...good to see you are charging decent rates, theres alot of lads out there that would do that job for half what you are estimating.

We have lost a few jobs to EWI companies recently...I've chased the quotes and the customer has opted for EWI rather than re render. Urbane Eco cleaning up in south Bristol, their rates are competitive to.
 
I
Jgreenplastering said:
I've just invested in a machine so no chance of me using traditional sand and cement ever again!

I could ask but they don't seem the sort who know how or where to start so just want it done properly without the chance of blame being put on them I suppose.




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Click to expand...

U can get prebagd Sand and cement (y)
 
theclemo said:
I


U can get prebagd Sand and cement (y)
Click to expand...

Yea still more expensive than traditional though.
I'm happy to used anything in a bag pre mixed basically just not stuff I have to put into a bell mixer and pre gauge.

I've never properly worked out the cost per m2 of traditional.

Usually about 1 ton to 8-10 bags of cement
Scratch coat.
1 ton to 10-12 bags top coat.
Plus additives and sbr for back ground prep.

Does about 35m2 per ton?

Plus you got the 2 coats against 1 of mono and then painting.

To me it's pre bagged all day long, more consistency, can offer warranties through product manufacturer plus a better modern finish.




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FreeD said:
Getting alot of this at the moment mate...good to see you are charging decent rates, theres alot of lads out there that would do that job for half what you are estimating.

We have lost a few jobs to EWI companies recently...I've chased the quotes and the customer has opted for EWI rather than re render. Urbane Eco cleaning up in south Bristol, their rates are competitive to.
Click to expand...

They a new company?
We are starting to do the Ewi now.
Bit of a nause getting gear but I'll find a way that's better.


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Jgreenplastering said:
They a new company?
We are starting to do the Ewi now.
Bit of a nause getting gear but I'll find a way that's better.


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Click to expand...

They have been around for a few years...they have a good reputation via word of mouth in South Bristol, and to be fair the work I have seen is quality. This use a breathable insulation, with a lime finish Baumit I think it's called.
 
Jgreenplastering said:
I'm not offering her any discount or doing the job for nothing as it wasn't my fault and I'm a business not a charity but what do others do in this situation?
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Click to expand...

You walk away mate.

I get the same every other week and it gets boring and i think its just the time of the year.

last 1 was last week possibly around 120m2 the lady had it done 3 years ago S&C and painted and its fooked, the people who had done her roof decided they wanted to have a go at rendering and on closer inspection you can see the judder marks with the trowel along with the obvious failure.
 
Jgreenplastering said:
They a new company?
We are starting to do the Ewi now.
Bit of a nause getting gear but I'll find a way that's better.


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Click to expand...

its also good that EWI gear is hard to get hold of in some respects, as soon as it becomes readily available the price will bottom out and every tom, dick and harry will be at it
 
You've gotta feel for her but I wonder how many quotes she got for the original work? Bet she went for the cheapest. Not your problem mate.
 
I hope for your sake she doesn't call back, but reading through your post I think the chances are quite big!
 
can you get the boys to boys to hack of the newly failed render, powerwash and prime with sbr or R7. lay a fully meshed coat of k rend hp12 straight over it and finish it with a thin topcoat. Personally i would use marmorit noblo.
The advantage here is 1, it will be cheaper for her, 2, far less mess for you to clean on a private job. 3, quicker pay day
 
£10-£12k is steep, sorry to say, maybe just an area thing

You'd get someone round here doing that for £4/£5k, we'd be more but that's what I'm up against.
 
@mac I think we live I'm afraid in plastering/rendering dogshit rate universe of south Yorkshire...

For the graft its foookin pittyful what we can consistently charge and win jobs at up here..

I often think listening to lads off here from other areas that I would foookin clear up in there areas!!!

10 yrs ago when the rewards where there I was a very very hungry organised spread....

Its got to the point where I just don't think the rewards are there anymore unless digging it on very good commercial work 5 days a week...

10yrs ago If I didn't clear 750 min but most weeks 1k+ I wasn't happy...now I just give up and just aim for a stress free weak and try not to think about the money or it just mugs me off
 
mac_plastering said:
£10-£12k is steep, sorry to say, maybe just an area thing

You'd get someone round here doing that for £4/£5k, we'd be more but that's what I'm up against.
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Got to jump in here and say same round here and agree I been wanting a machine for a number of reasons but would also be up against those same people .Even had one donk who prelimary booked for April agreed to price and then phoned to say the builder told him I might use a machine and then said he wanted the job doing for less money as "it won't take as long",before anyone says anything I have told him to find someone else already.
Just one reason I not been bothered about external lately.Am sure not everyone is like him but does make me think is it worth it.
 
I think alot of spreads cant be arsed doing traditional sand/cement work anymore?? Ive got a few to do soon and will post pics. Lets face it a belle mixer doesnt give you the grief some of these spraying machines do :endesacuerdo: :birra:
 
Said a while back the machines would bring the rates down fair enough the profits are high and you can do it quicker but the client will want a share. Maybe they give the impression it's not a skilled job and any man and his machine can do it? I agree my rate would be the same whether hand applying or machine but some lads with machine will still see a profit in a lesser rate and also the machine needs paying for. I had a guy call me yesterday about mono and its benefit and the only benefit I could see is you don't have to paint it straight away coz you have your colour, so is that the only benefit? I can see more benefits to sand and cement one being the price of materials and the test of time.
 
Come across a few jobs now where the sand/ cement is higher then i charge for mono ,Tbh i just think the younger lads dont want it any more ,or have not been taught it
 
keithuk said:
Come across a few jobs now where the sand/ cement is higher then i charge for mono ,Tbh i just think the younger lads dont want it any more ,or have not been taught it
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That's because of a few things in my eyes and that is the rates for mono has come right down, from when it first appeared on the market as a specialist product and the fact there are less and less skilled men who can float internally and render by hand with sand end cement externally. A skill that is getting lost in this country but will have a renaissance in the future, but with a massive shortage in the trade the rates will reflect this.
 
keithuk said:
Come across a few jobs now where the sand/ cement is higher then i charge for mono ,Tbh i just think the younger lads dont want it any more ,or have not been taught it
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I do a bit of heritage work for one of my regular builders, people pay through the nose for lime work!
 
flynnyman said:
Said a while back the machines would bring the rates down fair enough the profits are high and you can do it quicker but the client will want a share. Maybe they give the impression it's not a skilled job and any man and his machine can do it? I agree my rate would be the same whether hand applying or machine but some lads with machine will still see a profit in a lesser rate and also the machine needs paying for. I had a guy call me yesterday about mono and its benefit and the only benefit I could see is you don't have to paint it straight away coz you have your colour, so is that the only benefit? I can see more benefits to sand and cement one being the price of materials and the test of time.
Click to expand...

On the other side of the quoin though flinny if everyone has machines then the rates for traditional will go up because as kieth said theres less people to do it.
 
flynnyman said:
That's because of a few things in my eyes and that is the rates for mono has come right down, from when it first appeared on the market as a specialist product and the fact there are less and less skilled men who can float internally and render by hand with sand end cement externally. A skill that is getting lost in this country but will have a renaissance in the future, but with a massive shortage in the trade the rates will reflect this.
Click to expand...
I agree ,apart from rates coming down ,well not in my area any way .I have said for along time the art of s/c rendering is slowing fading ,and will become a highly profitable game to be in
 
When I first did mono 20 years (or more) ago it was £30 a metre in that area, wouldn't say it's a lot more now


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PFTwales said:
On the other side of the quoin though flinny if everyone has machines then the rates for traditional will go up because as kieth said theres less people to do it.
Click to expand...
I agree, also the other thing that's lost with all the bagged renders is nobody knows how to make a mix, what strength is needed and why. I have seen a few rendered jobs recently with sand and cement and they have dried a shocking colour rather than an even colour throughout.
 
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