advice about plastering over stickle artex possibly with asbestos

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clare

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Hi everyone :-)


I just found this site and was looking around. Theres lots of posts on here but just wanted to write my own to see what comes back.


I have artex on my ceilings that apparently contains a small amount of asbestos. I know this because my neighbour upstairs had hers removed.


It's in good condition and I want to get my plasterer to plaster over it.


One person who came and quoted said I can just plaster right onto it, another said put PVA on first and yet others said NO WAY to either of those 2 things, you need to do it properly and treat it with some (very expensive) stuff first.


I am not sure what that stuff is. I was told Thistlebond but when I checked it out it seems that its for putting onto SMOOTH surfaces and then it helps the plaster grip to it.


I get that, but my surface isn't smooth is it?! Then some people were saying knauf betokontakt. is good.


Ideally what I want is something that will be pretty thick so will level out the artex a bit so its easier for the plasterer to plaster. I was gonna paint whatever I pick- on first, prior to him coming.

It's not massively deep my artex, and its in an ex council place so I think it just went straight on to the concrete ceilings. Just not sure why there are so many different methods out there.

Before you suggest it, I don't want to overboard it! We are already doing enough other work to the place!


If anyone could spare 5 mins to let me know what you suggest I'd really appreciate it. My artex is the sort of effect like you would get with a stickle roller.


Thanks! Clare :-)
 
Bang and the thread was gone............................:RpS_thumbup:. what stu said.................:RpS_wink:
 
Problems, you would have to pva it for it to hold plaster, the problem that may arise is the artex de bonds from the ceiling, then you need to scrape it off, but legally you are not,supposed to as you are disturbing asbestos, it is apparently low level but I am a plasterer so get advice off the asbestos people,do not scrape it dry either as that is more dangerous, we all have done it over the years and we are not yet sure if we suffer for it.boarding over it hides the problem, the screws may cause dust to,go into the tradespersons lungs,
 
concrete ceilings this sounds like a flat. these ceilings cannot be overboarded!
i would scrape the artex, there is about 1% abestos in the mix.,apply pva ,then reskim. a every day job for a plasterer.
what area is the flat in clare? there will be someone on here who will be able to do the work for you.
 
Hi everyone thanks for the replies.

My neighbour upstairs in a council tenant and she complained to the council for nearly 2 years before they came and properly removed it all and then paid a plasterer to sort it out afterwards. I think a small area of her ceiling was water damaged or something, I'm not too sure.

I did look into doing that and it was coming out to about £2500 from proper asbestos removal people. Even THEY told me not to bother, they said if its in good condition (which it is) to just go over it. I called the council too and they said the same thing, the amount of asbestos would be so small, its much better to just leave it undisturbed.

The flat is in Archway, just at the top of Holloway Road. If anyone wants to give me a quote, sure, but I already got one for £500 for the whole flat ceilings (48 square metres) which I am super happy with, so feel free if you want, I saw another thread here where people didn't talk about money on here so sorry if that offends anyone, just sayin' :-)

Ive never hired a plasterer before so I don't know how prices compare, but I saw people up north doing it for about £4/ square metre on one forum, and I got one quote in london for £35 / square metre, the difference is just silly!

honestly I might just paint the ceilings as they are and leave them, its not a huge deal, I just want to know how to do it right if I DO do it.

So what, I can't even overboard it even if I wanted to because the ceilings are concrete?? Really? Can't you just drill into it and do the same overboarding that you would do anywhere else?

Sure, its gonna be REALLY hard work to drill anything into it, given, just curious as never done that before either. I drilled into the floors to build some built in wardrobes with a hammer drill and yeah, that was SUPER tough (I am a chick though!) so I can only imagine how much harder it would be to drill upwards, but if you use Man Tools and have a Man doing it ... then stuff just seems to get done ... ;-) lol!

So what, I have to PVA first, and then bonding plaster? What would happen if I just put bonding plaster on with no PVA and then got the plasterer in?

or what if I just used PVA and no bonding plaster?

what is bonding plaster? Is that the Thistlebond stuff? Or is that something the plasterer would do like an under coat of plaster or something?!

I'm gonna ask a few builders shops tomorrow I think.

Cheers for the replies!! Will pop back later or tomorrow. happy plastering!! :-)
 
I wouldnt do the priming yourself coz if it fails or there is a problem at a later date you will be blamed. If the ceilings are concrete you would batton the ceiling then board just leave it to the plasterer, any plasterer worth his salt will not let you do the prep and if they do steer clear. Get a few prices to give you an idea what it cost then go with who you feel is honest and knows what they are talking about.
 
Hi Clare. So many conflicting bits of advice and we re all tradesmen of many years so for what its worth heres my advice too.
Regarding rates, for a one off ceiling like yours people dont give a metreage rate. They generally look at it, work out time and materials and arrive at a figure. Metre rates are for large jobs.
Your ceiling: Without seeing it its difficult for anyone to advise properly. The thistle bond it you mentioned, if i was to use that over artex it would be because of vinyl paint being on there at some point. Without thistle bond it the plaster wouldnt adhere to the ceiling and could drop off. Again without seeing it its hard to advise properly, but if someones advised doing it, although a bit more money, better to be safe than sorry. Regarding whether to fill out with bonding backing plaster first again depends on how thick the plaster needs to be to cover. Builders/ tradesmen will always conflict over whats best for each job. One can only discuss and go with who you have most faith with.
Hope this helps :) Good luck.
 
clare said:
Hi everyone thanks for the replies.

My neighbour upstairs in a council tenant and she complained to the council for nearly 2 years before they came and properly removed it all and then paid a plasterer to sort it out afterwards. I think a small area of her ceiling was water damaged or something, I'm not too sure.

I did look into doing that and it was coming out to about £2500 from proper asbestos removal people. Even THEY told me not to bother, they said if its in good condition (which it is) to just go over it. I called the council too and they said the same thing, the amount of asbestos would be so small, its much better to just leave it undisturbed.

The flat is in Archway, just at the top of Holloway Road. If anyone wants to give me a quote, sure, but I already got one for £500 for the whole flat ceilings (48 square metres) which I am super happy with, so feel free if you want, I saw another thread here where people didn't talk about money on here so sorry if that offends anyone, just sayin' :-)

Ive never hired a plasterer before so I don't know how prices compare, but I saw people up north doing it for about £4/ square metre on one forum, and I got one quote in london for £35 / square metre, the difference is just silly!

honestly I might just paint the ceilings as they are and leave them, its not a huge deal, I just want to know how to do it right if I DO do it.

So what, I can't even overboard it even if I wanted to because the ceilings are concrete?? Really? Can't you just drill into it and do the same overboarding that you would do anywhere else?

Sure, its gonna be REALLY hard work to drill anything into it, given, just curious as never done that before either. I drilled into the floors to build some built in wardrobes with a hammer drill and yeah, that was SUPER tough (I am a chick though!) so I can only imagine how much harder it would be to drill upwards, but if you use Man Tools and have a Man doing it ... then stuff just seems to get done ... ;-) lol!

So what, I have to PVA first, and then bonding plaster? What would happen if I just put bonding plaster on with no PVA and then got the plasterer in?

or what if I just used PVA and no bonding plaster?

what is bonding plaster? Is that the Thistlebond stuff? Or is that something the plasterer would do like an under coat of plaster or something?!

I'm gonna ask a few builders shops tomorrow I think.

Cheers for the replies!! Will pop back later or tomorrow. happy plastering!! :-)
Click to expand...
Hi Clare, for over boarding ,you can have battens fixed to the concrete and then plasterboard them, lots do it for fitting new lights etc, bonding is an undercoat plaster, the price you got is fine, if you bond it without pva, it will fail, pva a section first and see if the pva soaks in, if it does ,it may need to be scraped off, I am south London based but if you need any advice, I will happily provide it. Be careful that the person doing it knows what they are doing,personally I like the battens idea...
 
clare said:
Hi everyone thanks for the replies.

My neighbour upstairs in a council tenant and she complained to the council for nearly 2 years before they came and properly removed it all and then paid a plasterer to sort it out afterwards. I think a small area of her ceiling was water damaged or something, I'm not too sure.

I did look into doing that and it was coming out to about £2500 from proper asbestos removal people. Even THEY told me not to bother, they said if its in good condition (which it is) to just go over it. I called the council too and they said the same thing, the amount of asbestos would be so small, its much better to just leave it undisturbed.

The flat is in Archway, just at the top of Holloway Road. If anyone wants to give me a quote, sure, but I already got one for £500 for the whole flat ceilings (48 square metres) which I am super happy with, so feel free if you want, I saw another thread here where people didn't talk about money on here so sorry if that offends anyone, just sayin' :-)

Ive never hired a plasterer before so I don't know how prices compare, but I saw people up north doing it for about £4/ square metre on one forum, and I got one quote in london for £35 / square metre, the difference is just silly!

honestly I might just paint the ceilings as they are and leave them, its not a huge deal, I just want to know how to do it right if I DO do it.

So what, I can't even overboard it even if I wanted to because the ceilings are concrete?? Really? Can't you just drill into it and do the same overboarding that you would do anywhere else?

Sure, its gonna be REALLY hard work to drill anything into it, given, just curious as never done that before either. I drilled into the floors to build some built in wardrobes with a hammer drill and yeah, that was SUPER tough (I am a chick though!) so I can only imagine how much harder it would be to drill upwards, but if you use Man Tools and have a Man doing it ... then stuff just seems to get done ... ;-) lol!

So what, I have to PVA first, and then bonding plaster? What would happen if I just put bonding plaster on with no PVA and then got the plasterer in?

or what if I just used PVA and no bonding plaster?

what is bonding plaster? Is that the Thistlebond stuff? Or is that something the plasterer would do like an under coat of plaster or something?!

I'm gonna ask a few builders shops tomorrow I think.

Cheers for the replies!! Will pop back later or tomorrow. happy plastering!! :-)
Click to expand...

Asbestos is asbestos no matter how much is in it. Drilling into the ceiling will release this into the air and if you get this in your lungs your in trouble. I admit the chances are extremely low but the danger is still there. In my opinion, and what i do regularly is pva,bond and skim. Why take the risk of disturbing it.
 
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Bonding plaster is a plaster that can go on thicker than finish plaster to level your ceiling out. As you have stipples you can't disturb you will need it
 
hey guys,

Men are awesome. they Know Stuff. :-)

Thank you SO MUCH for all the replies :-)

OK cool, so I have to put PVA on first for sure. :-)

I just spoke to Chris Stevens on Holloway Road and they said I dilute the PVA 1 part PVA : 4 parts water, is that right?? And Ive seen other peeps saying to put food dye in it so I can see where I've been?!

Do I just use one lot of PVA or 2 coats? Either way thats cool as its not that heavy. There IS paint on it already but not thick paint.

Then I see if the PVA sinks in or not. If it does then I need to try to scrape all the artex off, let's hope that doesn't happen.

Assuming it doesn't, then I get that plaster that stuart23 said about which is thick that should even out the stickles...

And then, what, get a finer finish type plaster at the end?!

If anyone wants to give me a quote for this please feel free, send me a PM :-)

as I said the guy gave me a job price (£480 just looking at his quote now) and Im happy so not especially looking, my job starts May 7th but I presume it'd be best to do this at the end, or at least, near the end, as we are building an extra wall and knocking down and moving a wall thats there - going from a 1-2 bed flat... so makes sense to me to only start sorting the ceilings once we have the rooms built, no?! :-)

the only reason I was going to do the prep was just cos I can do it in the evenings or weekends when the main builders aren't there!

I don't want to get in their way when they are doing plumbing and kitchens and stuff, my guy is happy to do it all I was just trying to save time really and be as helpful as I could to get the works finished ASAP.

Cheers! Clare :-)
 
LOL, stuart23, please can you send me a bigger picture of that bag of plaster stuff I need?!

Is that the thistlebond stuff or something else? looks like something else to me?

What would you use thistlebond for?

and also stuart23, also about the drilling into the asbestos, totally, thats why I just want to go over it. can't be too careful, for me and my tradespeople. its fine how it is just being there, so may as well leave it :-)

cheers!
 
If all the customers cared as much as you do clare the world would be a better place.

You deserve to have it done proper, so best of luck.
 
Clare your plasterer will have priced in for the materials so best just to let him get them. He will get them a lot cheaper then you and no plasterer likes to turn up at a job and the materials are there as can cause problems if they've not been stored right.
 
haha. thanks everyone. its so hard to get good reliable tradespeople. I used to do sound for TV and I was always happy with my day rate - (it was the getting up early part that sucked!) ... builders can be so sneaky!!

I called the super expensive builders today, to try to squeeze some information out of them, as when they came round they rubbed their (metaphoric) beards, looked at my ceiling and were like ... 'ooh...' - we know how to do it the proper way... (lol)

Me: oh ok, well what's that? can't you just plaster right on over it?

them : well, you need to treat it with some special stuff first, you can't just plaster on it, its really expensive, but we will do it properly... not like everyone else is telling you

me: well Im not even really sure if Im gonna bother with the ceiling, its sort of fine as is, no?! but cool, please put it in your quote

then, today (to be fair he was on holiday in cyprus, when he answered after the phone rung like it does when you're abroad - I was like, dude, lets just chat when you get back, no, it was only a qu about plastering my ceiling...)

him: no its fine, go ahead

me: ok, well I was just wondering what sort of stuff I need to put on the ceiling, cos you told me when you came round I needed this special stuff that was expensive, but I am not sure what it is

him: yes, you do, you must use this special stuff

me: ok, well please can you tell me what it is because I am just trying to do my budgets and you told me it was expensive so I just want to look at some prices for it

him: well, we just do it in OUR way, and it will be done really well

me : oh right then, well thanks anyway... (*doh, bangs head against wall!)

the mystery of the special under plaster stuff... can any of you guys solve it or is he just talking s**t?!!

i asked him about thistlebond and he didn't really say anything either way about it - why be so elusive?! its weird...! I dont get it.

lol, I know I have blond hair but men are funny...
 
Look clare the stuff is special he told you that, so stop mithering lol Its gypsum bondit or betacontact its the same stuff but different makes go in B&Q its about £50 a tub its just a posh PVA with a really nice colour and a grit added.
 
It's so special that they cannot tell you because they don't think you are special enough, jcr on the other hand will tell you about the special ah mmm pva ,
 
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