Advice needed on rendering work

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Colin McLeod

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Hi all. Looking for advice as to what to do re a newly rendered garden wall. The wall is constructed of concrete blocks with block paving to the rear elevation and the garden to the other.



I appointed a contractor to render the wall (front and rear elevations and across the top) in Monocouche render after having found him on one of the 'trusted' websites' where he had over 30 'recommendations'



I'm concerned about the finished job (note - despite my best DIY attempts I am not and will never be a plasterer so I might be overstating the problems). In summary my concerns are - and I have attached photos to show the areas of concern....



1. The beading used throughout the job is stop bead instead of angle bead. Does this mean that the render will only 'adhere' to one side of the bead (the side where the mesh is) and could pull away/crack from the other non meshed edge....it has already cracked open at one corner after only 4 days

2. The beading looks a right mess to me....bad alignment to end joints and corners?

3. On the block paving side the render has been applied right down to the blocks with no beading at the bottom - does this put it at risk of rising damp/staining?

4. On the garden side there is no beading applied to the bottom edge - the render is applied right down to/below the soil level - again a rising damp/staining problem?

5. On the top surface the render is concave and when it rains the water pools on the surface - problem with staining?

6. The corners where the beads are supposed to meet look totally botched?

7. At one corner the render is already cracking away from the adjoining render after only 4 days.

8. In some places where the render meets the beads the render sits proud of the beading and has been chamfered in resulting in a very poor looking finish

9. At the end of one wall there is no render applied to the vertical surface resulting in a very dodgy looking end to the joint with the adjacent wall
20170927_170347.jpg



If the job is as bad as I think it is I'm looking at what options I have to remedy this problem- both in terms of the rendering itself and getting back all or some of the £850 I paid.

My main concern is that the whole job is botched and needs redoing which means taking off the render and starting again - in your opinion is this the only real option or am I overstating the possible problems? Would I instead be able to render over the top in the good old fashioned sand and cement render assuming the monocouche has adhered properly to the concrete blocks.

Comments welcome
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Tbh I think it looks ok

Look forward to what the others say though, I hate mono on these garden walls I'd of gone with ocr instead
 
I would say its pants....

angle beads should be used at external angles...

beading along the bottom isnt nessesary on planters as there is no dpc.. staining will happen regardless of render as its splash back from surface dirt.

the tops should have a slight gradient for water to run off.
i tend to use 10mm on front face. 6mm on rear. or 15/10mm so water runs into flower bed...
 
Dansouthcoast84 said:
I would say its pants....

angle beads should be used at external angles...

beading along the bottom isnt nessesary on planters as there is no dpc.. staining will happen regardless of render as its splash back from surface dirt.

the tops should have a slight gradient for water to run off.
i tend to use 10mm on front face. 6mm on rear. or 15/10mm so water runs into flower bed...
Click to expand...
Agree with you s**t job no care for customer,surprised he got paid,some sort of coping everytime for me
 
I can see the beads not matching up being annoying. Using stop bread on a 3 way outside corner isn't ideal for matching everything up but from the pics the surfaces look like they were floated alright. Beads at the bottom on a masonry wall are almost never done unless you specifically ask for it and then you should expect to pay for it as well. Those are a pain and is a different type of bead with weeps to let water out. To address your points in order.

1. Yes you will get hairline cracks along the bead. (to be fair you might have either way though. But I would've used corner bead or just done it by hand.)

2. Yes that 3 way outside corner isn't ideal. It takes some time to make those look good and not everyone has the patience.

3. Render to the deck shouldn't be a problem imo. Staining will come primarily from rain hitting the dirt near the wall and splashing it up onto the wall. Rising damp, meh, its an exterior wall. It'll dry out. Having bead at the bottom isn't wrong but not standard and again expect to pay more for that.

4. Very common to take stucco (render) below grade. 'staining' from water splashing as described above will happen either way, bead or no bead. You can clean it off with a hose.

5. Again not ideal bound to happen at least a few spots if bead isn't intentionality sloped. Shouldn't be a huge problem for awhile as long as you don't have significant standing water. (expect some deterioration from freeze/thaw though. Standard practice will be to account for this but it never hurts to specifically ask for it.)

6. Bead meeting up is also a pain. See #2

7. Walls are going to move and 1/2 to 7/8" of stucco isn't going to stop that. I always tell customers a thin veneer of mud isn't structural and I will guarantee I will use reinforcement but I can't grantee it will stop a 200 ton wall from moving when it rains and the ground lifts that much weight. The old timers I worked with said "The sun is hot, water is wet, and stucco cracks." realistic expectations make for contentment in that regard.

8. Yes the bead was over filled. Could have been that the bead wasn't set proud enough initially, the wall has a wicked bow in it, just a mistake spreading or a combination of all 3. You'll see those occasionally if you don't have all the time in the world to make dots, mud screeds, etc. Nobody does that anymore and fewer want to pay for it but it can make a perfect plum and true wall.

9. Yes returning the mud to the wall would have looked better and it doesn't look like the ship has sailed on that option. Those corners are a pain and attention to detail/lack thereof is seen in spots like that. But if you want every I dotted and T crossed just be prepared to pay for it. I can't tell how large the job is exactly but. For $1138 you got a pretty good deal imo. I would've charged more especially if I know I'll need to take my time to get the details just so.

Conclusion - Nobody wants to throw a fellow craftsman under the bus and I've tried to be fair. You got a below average to average job for a modest price. Yes there will be issues, cosmetic and otherwise. (specifically the lack of draining from the top is going to bite you eventually) To me it comes down to getting the best job you are willing to pay for. Expect to pay more for a quality craftsman to address all the things you mentioned. (or you may decide they aren't that important to you and you'll correct it when it has to be done again... And it will need to be done again in 5-10 years guaranteed)
 
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It's not a very good job, can you live with it or not...? Only you as a paying punter can answer that.
 
Garden walls weathered on all 4 sides, bad idea from start to finish. Ok in Spain and so on. Could overcoat it but it won't last, tile it if you want the white walls look. Bit more weatherproof. Sandstone copings with a drip on, paint it?? Beads won't show up as bad. Anything like that so low to the ground facing brick or railway sleepers if it's newly constructed.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Whats the reason ending with jobs like this ? Well, you either realise you have been underpaid at the beginning or short after, hence the rush and you get what you paid for attitude and finish.
 
vfr12 said:
Whats the reason iending with jobs like this ? Well, you either realise you have been underpaid at the beginning or short after, hence the rush and you get what you paid for attitude and finish.
Click to expand...
I I priced this job at a higher rate knowing what care was needed,also stressed to client cheapest is not the best way forward,unfortunately went for cheaper quote,some customers don't realise cost of material and more importantly time on detailed work
 
Who’s idea was it to not have copings?

The tops will turn green soon and will probably lift.

I have stopped doing garden walls. No thought goes into how they should be built for rendering. Most fail and it is usually down to bad design rather than application, but the rendersr is usually guilty till found innocent.
 
People think a daft little garden wall is straight forward,as rigs by says there's many elements to take into consideration therefore costing money,probs not worth bothering with,client thinks you're too pricey but more thought goes int it than a full house!!
 
It was, had to keep running round to bring each side along because you couldn't get your hand through the rails. I sloped it like a china mans hat to so water would run off. Can really tell in the pic though. Top took about 8-9 bags. Fair old run


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
There you go there’s a good example of beads on the piss but at least he used the right ones!
 
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